Denied Better main weapon for Grenadier

[Yamato]

Suggestion: Better main weapon for Grenadier

Currently the Grenadiers main weapon is the E-11, the Ping Launcher is a weapon you switch to when the time is right, effectively making the Grenadier the same as the enlisted when explosive equipment isn’t allowed or in a tight space. My suggestion is to give Grenadier a different weapon for their main weapon, I believe a Grenadiers primary objective is suppressive fire for other troopers so a fast firing weapon like the DLT-19 would be ideal as it would allow the Grenadier to keep up suppressive fire in smaller areas where explosives would not be ideal.

How will this affect the server?: I believe it would give more balance between the ST sub regiments, as right now Scouts have a lot more stuff they can do compared to Grenadiers, such as riding a speeder or reconnaissance, as well as their EC-17 which is their primary weapon when not sniping. It would also help make people more attracted to Grenadiers as a sub regiment, since right now most people join either Scouts or FMED’s.

Additional Notes/Relevant Links:

 

[NamiiDesu]

+1, this sounds like a fun addition to Grenadier as it makes it more of a HVY like the battlefront games then just a explosive ST

 

[cosmicspacedog]

DLT-19 is shocks so im not sure that would be allowed, however there is the SMG varient (DLT-19s)

 

[Derpi]

+1 Maybe not the DLT-19, but like cosmic said. The DLT-19s or something like that!

 

[Yamato]

Personally don't see the issue with sharing a weapon, since it'll only be the subclass that gets it not the entirety of the Stormtrooper Corps, I picked the DLT-19 as I think due to its mag size and fire rate it has the best suppressive fire capabilities. And if sharing weapons is the issue 501st also use the DLT-19s so we wouldn't be allowed that either.

 

[cosmicspacedog]

The 501st weapon is the t-21. To the best of my knowledge im sure the DLT-19s isnt 501st exclusive.

 

[Yamato]

In that case neither is the DLT-19 as Raven Heavies have it.

 

[cosmicspacedog]

Didnt know that! Thank you for expanding my knowledge.

 

[Senzuwa]

-1

Your argument for it is a fallacy. You could say the exact same thing for a lot of sub-classes.

Medic - Once you remove his bacta he’s just a regular stormtrooper

Flametrooper - Once you remove his flamethrower he’s just a regular stormtrooper

Riot Trooper - Once you remove his shield and dioxis he’s just a regular shock trooper

Heavy Trooper - Once you remove his mini gun he’s just a regular 501st trooper

It’s a grenadier, it shoots grenades, not DLT-19s. It shouldn’t be added to it and if we’re adding it to him, why aren’t we adding to the rest?

 

[Yamato]

-1

Your argument for it is a fallacy. You could say the exact same thing for a lot of sub-classes.

Medic - Once you remove his bacta he’s just a regular stormtrooper

Flametrooper - Once you remove his flamethrower he’s just a regular stormtrooper

Riot Trooper - Once you remove his shield and dioxis he’s just a regular shock trooper

Heavy Trooper - Once you remove his mini gun he’s just a regular 501st trooper

It’s a grenadier, it shoots grenades, not DLT-19s. It shouldn’t be added to it and if we’re adding it to him, why aren’t we adding to the rest?

It adds more life to the sub class, for example,

FMEDs - They have multiple healing equipment, allowing them to use their equipment at all times, they can do passive roleplay due to their status as a medic.

Flametrooper - I agree, without the Flamethrower this is just a beefy Stormtrooper, maybe a different weapon should be added for when the Flamethrower isn't allowed use so it doesn't make the job useless on some missions.

Riot Trooper - Trained in several more things, such as interrogations, negotiations, and close-quarter combat.

Heavy Trooper - Still has an arsenal of weapons for use when the minigun is not in use.

As for the fact it's a grenadier, like I said I believe it's main purpose is to act as more of a suppressive fire unit, maybe changing it to something more akin of a Heavy Trooper in ST's too allow for the job to do more than it currently does.

 

[NamiiDesu]

It adds more life to the sub class, for example,

FMEDs - They have multiple healing equipment, allowing them to use their equipment at all times, they can do passive roleplay due to their status as a medic.

Flametrooper - I agree, without the Flamethrower this is just a beefy Stormtrooper, maybe a different weapon should be added for when the Flamethrower isn't allowed use so it doesn't make the job useless on some missions.

Riot Trooper - Trained in several more things, such as interrogations, negotiations, and close-quarter combat.

Heavy Trooper - Still has an arsenal of weapons for use when the minigun is not in use.

As for the fact it's a grenadier, like I said I believe it's main purpose is to act as more of a suppressive fire unit, maybe changing it to something more akin of a Heavy Trooper in ST's too allow for the job to do more than it currently does.

To add onto the final statement. The heavies on ST's in lore carried explosive launchers (such as the ping launcher) and used a heavy weapon for a primary instead of an E-11 to be a supressive and supportive class who can take several hostiles at once instead of an explosive stormtrooper. A good weapon for these would be a standard issue DLT-19 or even a T-21/ One of the two miniguns, as all these were used by the Stormtrooper Heavies in lore (Based on games such as the Battlefront series, a canon game line, And the comics/series)

 

[Senzuwa]

To add onto the final statement. The heavies on ST's in lore carried explosive launchers (such as the ping launcher) and used a heavy weapon for a primary instead of an E-11 to be a supressive and supportive class who can take several hostiles at once instead of an explosive stormtrooper. A good weapon for these would be a standard issue DLT-19 or even a T-21/ One of the two miniguns, as all these were used by the Stormtrooper Heavies in lore (Based on games such as the Battlefront series, a canon game line, And the comics/series)

It's really nerdy to bring up lore but if you really wanna go down that route, sure. No. The grenadiers in lore did not use DLT-19s and T-21s, and they most definitely did not use miniguns ahaha, you can read their equipment here https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Stormtrooper_grenadier and here https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Stormtrooper_Grenadier

These are not "Heavies" these are grenadiers.

 

[Senzuwa]

FMEDs - They have multiple healing equipment, allowing them to use their equipment at all times, they can do passive roleplay due to their status as a medic.

Like I said, when you remove their bacta, they become normal stormtroopers. Any trooper can do passive roleplay.

Riot Trooper - Trained in several more things, such as interrogations, negotiations, and close-quarter combat.

Any trooper can train. Training is not the same as the 'equipment' which you so desperately want. So again, the riot are the same as a standard shock when you remove their gear.

Heavy Trooper - Still has an arsenal of weapons for use when the minigun is not in use.

"Still has an arsenal" ---- yes.... an arsenal of normal 501st equipment..................

As for the fact it's a grenadier, like I said I believe it's main purpose is to act as more of a suppressive fire unit, maybe changing it to something more akin of a Heavy Trooper in ST's too allow for the job to do more than it currently does.

Then make the suggestion about changing the sub-class into something else. Adding equipment to a role that makes no sense to have that equipment is just weird. It seems to me like you don't really understand what you're trying to ask for. To me, the problem looks like you want to change the class, not add to it, which isn't what your suggestion is asking for.

 

[Senzuwa]

Suggestion: Better main weapon for Grenadier

Currently the Grenadiers main weapon is the E-11, the Ping Launcher is a weapon you switch to when the time is right, effectively making the Grenadier the same as the enlisted when explosive equipment isn’t allowed or in a tight space. My suggestion is to give Grenadier a different weapon for their main weapon, I believe a Grenadiers primary objective is suppressive fire for other troopers so a fast firing weapon like the DLT-19 would be ideal as it would allow the Grenadier to keep up suppressive fire in smaller areas where explosives would not be ideal.

How will this affect the server?: I believe it would give more balance between the ST sub regiments, as right now Scouts have a lot more stuff they can do compared to Grenadiers, such as riding a speeder or reconnaissance, as well as their EC-17 which is their primary weapon when not sniping. It would also help make people more attracted to Grenadiers as a sub regiment, since right now most people join either Scouts or FMED’s.

Additional Notes/Relevant Links:

In any case though, I think the current gear is perfectly fine and you just need to be more creative. You say that explosives aren't ideal and that it's unbalanced as if that's a common problem. The only time they aren't ideal is in close-quarters combat and I'm sorry but "balancing" does mean that equipment has strengths and weaknesses so of course it's not going to be usable 24/7. That's why they can fall back onto standard stormtrooper gear which works perfectly fine for CQC.

And when they are usable you completely waste them. What kind of training have the grenadiers been given by ST command? What kind of structure are they given by ST command? In the battlefield are they effectively used by ST command?

Even something as simple as having multiple grenadiers perform volley fire would be fun and effective for clearing out a lot of hostiles. So to me it seems like you want to shift the blame of the laziness of ST command onto someone else instead of actually doing your job and solving the problem.

 

[NamiiDesu]

It's really nerdy to bring up lore but if you really wanna go down that route, sure. No. The grenadiers in lore did not use DLT-19s and T-21s, and they most definitely did not use miniguns ahaha, you can read their equipment here https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Stormtrooper_grenadier and here https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Stormtrooper_Grenadier

These are not "Heavies" these are grenadiers.

I was more suggesting changing the Grenadiers to a heavy, but the link to the legends page just brought up the perfect new gun for them, as stated there "Their main weapon was the SE-14 blaster pistol, but they also used thermal detonators to kill multiple enemies and destroy vehicles.[1]" so the SE-14 (or SE-14r If the one without the scope isnt on the server) could be a great change of equipment for them!

 

[Yamato]

In any case though, I think the current gear is perfectly fine and you just need to be more creative. You say that explosives aren't ideal and that it's unbalanced as if that's a common problem. The only time they aren't ideal is in close-quarters combat and I'm sorry but "balancing" does mean that equipment has strengths and weaknesses so of course it's not going to be usable 24/7. That's why they can fall back onto standard stormtrooper gear which works perfectly fine for CQC.

And when they are usable you completely waste them. What kind of training have the grenadiers been given by ST command? What kind of structure are they given by ST command? In the battlefield are they effectively used by ST command?

Even something as simple as having multiple grenadiers perform volley fire would be fun and effective for clearing out a lot of hostiles. So to me it seems like you want to shift the blame of the laziness of ST command onto someone else instead of actually doing your job and solving the problem.

I just feel like right now Grenadier seems more of a gimmick, "Look here we have explosives." whereas any other class that also has explosives has equipment other than just the Ping Launcher/Grenades to complement it.

Wanted to make it seem a bit more fun so that when you aren't allowed to use your equipment you have a better blaster to use.

 

[Senzuwa]

I was more suggesting changing the Grenadiers to a heavy, but the link to the legends page just brought up the perfect new gun for them, as stated there "Their main weapon was the SE-14 blaster pistol, but they also used thermal detonators to kill multiple enemies and destroy vehicles.[1]" so the SE-14 (or SE-14r If the one without the scope isnt on the server) could be a great change of equipment for them!

Oh my god don't call it the perfect new gun hahaha --- pistols on this server are done so badly. The only usable one is the scout pistol which is just brokenly OP. Did you know stormtroopers have an RK-3 pistol on this server? I didn't, because I've never seen them used, that's because the primary gun is better in every way and there's no incentive to switch to your pistol, it's not much faster to switch weapons than it is to reload and also pistol ammo is linked to the ammo of your primary gun.

 

[Senzuwa]

I just feel like right now Grenadier seems more of a gimmick, "Look here we have explosives." whereas any other class that also has explosives has equipment other than just the Ping Launcher/Grenades to complement it.

Wanted to make it seem a bit more fun so that when you aren't allowed to use your equipment you have a better blaster to use.

Again, we've already gone over the fact that MANY subdivisions could say the exact same thing, but like you pointed out they have so much more that they can do which doesn’t require the staff team to add new equipment.

So really, it’s up to you and your ST command to fix this. Not lump it on the server and make them solve the problem for you.

 

[NamiiDesu]

Oh my god don't call it the perfect new gun hahaha --- pistols on this server are done so badly. The only usable one is the scout pistol which is just brokenly OP. Did you know stormtroopers have an RK-3 pistol on this server? I didn't, because I've never seen them used, that's because the primary gun is better in every way and there's no incentive to switch to your pistol, it's not much faster to switch weapons than it is to reload and also pistol ammo is linked to the ammo of your primary gun.

From previously having the SE-14r i know its a great weapon to use for burst damage, and can sometimes be better then the E-11. The reason people dont use the RK-3 is the slower fire rate and less ammo, but with the SE-14r its faster, deals more damage and could greatly compliment qucikly finishing an enemy that survived a grenade

 

[Senzuwa]

From previously having the SE-14r i know its a great weapon to use for burst damage, and can sometimes be better then the E-11. The reason people dont use the RK-3 is the slower fire rate and less ammo, but with the SE-14r its faster, deals more damage and could greatly compliment qucikly finishing an enemy that survived a grenade

An E-11 can finish off the enemy just as quick after firing an entire grenade at it. What’s your point?